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Condensing gas boiler systems FAQ

Subject: DIBT-No

Question/problem:
The end customer requires a DIBT no. of the Modula for the revenue office.

Subject: Suitability for other primary energy sources

Question/problem:
Is the neutralisation container with order numbers 02-8052, -8053 and -8054 also suitable for condensate from a chimney with which a low temperature oil boiler or an oil condensing boiler is operated?

Subject: Boiler replacement

Question/problem:
GB 180 as an attic-based heating system is to be replaced by a Modula II: does the flue gas system match or does the flue gas system have to be replaced?

Subject: Flue gas evacuation regulations

Question/problem:
Does the installation engineer have to lag air / flue gas pipes if they pass into the chimney from the boiler room (cellar) through the hall in the next room?

Subject: Conversion

Question/problem:
Converting from a higher output to a lower output or vice-versa.

Subject: Locking upon failure, e.g. condensate pump

Question/problem:
How can the Modula 3.5 – 28 kW be locked / switched off if the external condensate pump fails, and is there a connection for fault shutdown?

Subject: Error 5.08

Question/problem:
Error 5.08 always occurs in a Modula (not an attic-based heating system) when there is a storm. What can be done to prevent the error?

Subject: Error code 01 and 05

Question/problem:
The boiler often switches to fault 01 or 05 (short circuit in the 24 volt electrical circuit or EMC fault

Subject: Boiler pump

Question/problem:
Can a gunmetal pump be used as a boiler pump in the Modula II (oxygen diffusion)?

Subject: Gas combination block

Question/problem:
Leak testing for new gas pipe (110 mbar). Is the gas combination block resistant to this pressure or is it approved for this?

Subject: Sealant

Question/problem:
How does heating sealant react with our Modula and can it be used without problems?

Subject: Noise emissions

Question/problem:
What is the noise level for single and parallel operation of the condensing gas boiler units?

Subject: Operating location

Question/problem:
Can Modula condensing gas boilers be operated in children’s rooms and bedrooms?

Subject: Materials

Question/problem:
What are the water-carrying pipes in the Modula made of?

Subject: Ignition electrode

Question/problem:
What causes an ignition electrode in the Modula II to be barely there after a short period (highly eroded)?

Subject: Liquid gas

Question/problem:

What settings must be made on the Modula I if the spring clip is removed and the system is converted for liquid gas?

Subject: Gas pressure measurement

Question/problem:

There are two pressure measurement nipples on the gas combination block. The lower one is used to measure the pending gas pressure. The upper one is used to measure the gas which flows into the burner when the valve is open – underpressure. Is there a minimum pressure for this that can be measured there (-1 mbar)?

Subject: Boiler replacement

Question/problem:

After a boiler replacement, can the Modula II simply be connected to the old flue gas system (still with ALU Logo IXAL Z-7.1.504)?

Subject: Gas combination block

Question/problem:

What is the maximum connection pressure that can be applied to the gas combination block of the old GB 10-28?

Subject: Cooling of the condensing gas boiler when idle

Question/problem:

How much can a Modula II boiler with 40 kW cool off via the air / flue gas collector chimney pipe, and what output can reach the flue gas system past the fan?

Subject: Replacement part delivery guarantee

Question/problem:

How long will replacement parts for the condensing gas boilers be available?

Subject: Fluorescent tube in the heating room

Question/problem:

May a fluorescent tube be installed and operated in the vicinity of the Modula II without interfering with the electronics and functioning of the boiler?

Subject: Condensate lift pump

Question/problem:

How does the additional float switch with the floating contacts function and when is the contact closed?

Subject: External magnetic valve

Question/problem:

For liquid gas operation, the external magnetic valve is to be activated via the contact (terminal 23 and 24) for the operating signal. What is the maximum load that can be applied to this contact?

Subject: Gas pressure

Question/problem:

Can a gas pressure of 30 mbar (natural gas) cause problems?

Subject: Threaded bolts

Question/problem:

What should be done if the threaded bolts fastening the inspection cover are “torn off” the heat exchanger or are very loose?ist

Subject: Fuse F4

Question/problem:

In PL-0203 page 12, the power supply is protected by fuse F4 - 2 AT, and 3 A is entered in Fig. 7. What rating is required for the fuse protection?

Subject: Fault code E10 / bleeding programme

Question/problem:

What is to be done when error E10 is displayed? What causes this error?

Answers for condensing gas boiler systems

Question/problem:
The end customer requires a DIBT no. of the Modula for the revenue office.

Answer:We do not have a DIBT number for any of our boilers, as such numbers are not necessary and do not carry any advantages. All our devices are CE certified and comply with the requirements of the Gas Appliances Directive (90/396/EEC) and the Boiler Efficiency Directive (92/42/EEC).

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Question/problem:
Is the neutralisation container with order numbers 02-8052, -8053 and -8054 also suitable for condensate from a chimney with which a low temperature oil boiler or an oil condensing boiler is operated?

Answer: Our neutralisation containers and condensate lift pumps are only suitable for use with condensing gas devices. Reason: the material of the containers is resistant up to a pH value of 2.8. However, the condensate in oil condensing devices can reach a pH value of up to 1.8. Further information: Mommertz offers special neutralisation containers for oil condensing boilers which are fitted with activated carbon filters. Please call +49(0)8221/8238 for further details.

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Question/problem:
GB 180 as an attic-based heating system is to be replaced by a Modula II: is the flue gas system sufficient or does the flue gas system have to be replaced?

Answer: 1.) The flue gas system is generally sufficient for the new boiler if the old flue gas system was made by Paradigma. The only thing to be noted is that a transition piece (02-8330) is required for DN 70 or DN 70/125 plastic systems. 2.) The flue gas system generally does not have to be replaced. It is sufficient to install an additional air / flue gas inspection pipe. The dimensions of the existing flue gas pipe are also important.

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Question/problem:
Does the installation engineer have to lag air / flue gas pipes if they pass into the chimney from the boiler room (cellar) through the hall in the next room?

Answer: Flue gas pipes (also air / flue gas systems), which bridge storeys or rooms, except in the installation room of the furnace, must always be installed in a separate shaft or lagged. The shafts must have a fire resistance period of 90 minutes or 30 minutes in low buildings. "Low buildings" are defined in the corresponding state building regulations.

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Question/problem:
Converting from a higher output to a lower output or vice-versa.

Answer: This is technically possible, but the type plate must also be replaced accordingly, and this is prohibited under ISO9001. Therefore, conversion can only be performed by replacing the boiler.

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Question/problem:
How can the Modula 3.5 – 28 kW be locked / switched off if the external condensate pump fails, and is there a connection for fault shutdown?

Answer: There is generally no way to lock the boiler should a condensate pump fail. However, in the new condensate pump which we have offered since April 2001 (manufactured by Mommertz, order no. 02-8051), there are two cables at the pump head. These two cables form a floating contact to which an error message (e.g. lamp or horn) can be connected to indicate that the condensate pump is defective.

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Question/problem:
Error 5.08 always occurs in a Modula (not an attic-based heating system) when there is a storm. What can be done to prevent the error?

Answer: Downwinds are the most likely cause for the problems. Tip: cut a flue gas bend (87°) directly after the bend and attach it to the outlet pipe so that the open side of the cut-off bend faces away from the direction of the prevailing winds.

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Question/problem:
The boiler often switches to fault 01 or 05 (short circuit in the 24 volt electrical circuit or EMC fault)

Answer: The following items must be checked: all components connected to the 24 volt electrical circuit should be checked for short circuits or damage. If there are point-to-point radio aerials or transmission masts installed in the vicinity, grid filters should be installed retrospectively in the grid supply line, in the sensor and external sensor lines. If telephone cables were used for the sensor cables, you must ensure that they are earthed. Telephone cables are generally wrapped in a thin aluminium-coloured film which acts as shielding. If this film is not earthed (remove a piece, wind it around itself and connect it to the earthing terminal), the film loses its shielding effect and can even act as an amplifier for electromagnetic interference.

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Question/problem:
Can a gunmetal pump be used as a boiler pump in the Modula II (oxygen diffusion)?

Answer: Gunmetal pumps (or bronze pumps) generally have nothing to do with oxygen diffusion. Gunmetal pumps only have to be used for drinking water systems. Of course, you can also use gunmetal pumps in the Modula II, if suppliers offer these pumps with an installed length of 130 mm. If not, the pump must be positioned outside the boiler.

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Question/problem:
Leak testing for new gas pipe (110 mbar). Is the gas combination block resistant to this pressure or is it approved for this?

Answer: Gas pipe system testing consists of a leak test and includes the pipes and their fittings, but excludes the gas devices and the corresponding control and safety equipment.

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Question/problem:
How does heating sealant react with our Modula and can it be used without problems?

Answer: We strongly advise against using chemical agents (see the installation/commissioning instructions).

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Question/problem:
What is the noise level for single and parallel operation of the condensing gas boiler units?

Answer: The noise emission level of a single Modula II 41 kW or 61 kW is 48 dBA (distance to boiler: 1 m) Values for cascade systems are not known.

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Question/problem:
Modula condensing gas boilers be operated in children’s rooms and bedrooms?

Answer: The system may be operated in bedrooms, however it is unadvisable, as there is always a certain noise level. Use in residential rooms, e.g. an office, kitchen or hall is no problem. The device is so quite that the sound it emits is generally not a disturbance in these rooms.

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Question/problem:
What are the water-carrying pipes in the Modula made of?

Answer: The water-carrying pipes are made of zinc-plated iron piping.

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Question/problem:
What causes an ignition electrode in the Modula II to be barely there after a short period (highly eroded)?

Answer: First, check what kind of ignition electrode is installed. If the ignition electrode is labelled "KR", it is possible that this electrode does not last for more than six months. However, we have not had these ignition electrodes in our range for over a year.
The ignition electrodes currently used are labelled "MX" and they last for at least one year or longer. If one of these "MX" initiation electrodes fails after a short time, this is probably due to halogens in the combustion air or a high concentration of odorisers (aromatic substances) in the gas. Halogens are primarily to be found in solvents, washing and cleaning agents. These problems generally arise when the boiler is dependent on ambient air and such substances are stored in the installation room.

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Question/problem:
What settings must be made on the Modula I if the spring clip is removed and the system is converted for liquid gas?

Antwort:When removing the spring clip from a Modula 1 which is run on liquid gas, the same speed changes must be made as for natural gas boilers (see sticker). However, the CO2 value should be set to 10.7 % ± 0.5 %.

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Question/problem:
There are two pressure measurement nipples on the gas combination block. The lower one is used to measure the pending gas pressure. The upper one is used to measure the gas which flows into the burner when the valve is open – underpressure. Is there a minimum pressure for this that can be measured there (-1 mbar)?

Antwort: In the Modula I and Modula II, the pressures measured are generally the same. When the gas combination block is closed, you can measure the pending idle pressure (generally approximately 20 mbar) at the lower pressure measurement nipple (P in). When the gas combination block is open, you can measure the flow pressure (generally between 17 mbar and 19 mbar). At the upper pressure measurement nipple (P out) you can measure an underpressure at which the blower sucks in the gas when the gas combination block is open. This is generally between -1 mbar and -3 mbar depending on the fan speed. There are no pressure tables for this, as the combined gas-air regulation operates without problems at the prescribed idle pressure of 20 mbar or 50 mbar for liquid gas. Thus, the reference variable is generally the pending idle pressure.

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Question/problem:
After a boiler replacement, can the Modula II simply be connected to the old flue gas system (still with ALU Logo IXAL Z-7.1.504)?

Answer: Of course, the Modula II can be connected to an aluminium flue gas system. The boiler and the aluminium flue gas system were each separately tested and approved and can be operated together. The old boiler was also a condensing gas unit. Further information: the Modula II devices are labelled on the type plate in accordance with the Gas Appliances Directive 90/396/EEC for the approved gas appliance types. Thus, the Modula II devices are also labelled C63x. That means that the gas furnace is approved for connection to a combustion air supply and flue gas piping which is not tested and certified with the gas furnace. Chimney sweeps generally know this labelling and its meaning.

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Question/problem:
What is the maximum connection pressure that can be applied to the gas combination block of the old GB 10-28?

Answer: Maximum 100 mbar, also stated on the type plate of all gas combination blocks.

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Question/problem:
How much can a Modula II boiler with 40-kW cool off via the air / flue gas collector chimney pipe, and what output can reach the flue gas system past the fan?

Answer: The heat exchanger capacity in the Modula 11 41 kW is only 5.5 litres. The heat quantity lost by the heat exchanger with so little water when idle is therefore insignificant. To clarify this – the average loss when the Modula 11 41 kW is ready for operation at a heat exchanger temperature of 70°C is approximately 190 watts. This decreases rapidly at lower heat exchanger temperatures.

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Question/problem:
How long will replacement parts for the condensing gas boilers be available?

Answer: After a boiler type is discontinued, or is replaced by a subsequent model, we are obliged to guarantee a supply of replacement parts for at least 10 years. However, we will strive to ensure that replacement parts are available for more than 10 years.

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Question/problem:
May a fluorescent tube be installed and operated in the vicinity of the Modula II without interfering with the electronics and function of the boiler?

Answer: If the fluorescent tube has a CE mark (which is generally the case), no problems are to be expected, as these tubes are interference suppressed. In order to be sure, connect the fluorescent tube to a second current circuit (second phase). This rules out any possible effects.

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Question/problem:
How does the additional float switch with the floating contacts function and when is the contact closed?

Answer: If the condensate in the container exceeds the switching height of the pump, the float switch closes the floating contact. This allows a lamp or an audible signal to be triggered to indicate that the pump is defective.

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Question/problem:
For liquid gas operation, the external magnetic valve is to be activated via the contact (terminal 23 and 24) for the operating signal. What is the maximum load that can be applied to this contact?

Answer: Theoretically, 8 amperes can be applied to the relay. However, the control box is fused with a 2 ampere fuse, which means that 2 amperes is the upper limit.

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Question/problem:
Can a gas pressure of 30 mbar (natural gas) cause problems?

Answer: The rated heat load of the boiler or the correct regulating function of the gas combination block is designed for the specified idle pressure of 20 mbar. If the gas pressure is higher, more gas passes through the gas combination block. This affects the flue gas values and the heat load of the boiler. Therefore, you should always ensure that the idle pressure does not exceed 20 mbar.

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Question/problem:
What should be done if the threaded bolts fastening the inspection cover are “torn off” the heat exchanger or are very loose?

Answer: Torn out or seriously damaged threaded holes in the heat exchanger cannot be repaired. In such cases, the heat exchanger must be replaced entirely.

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Question/problem:
In PL-0203 page 12, the power supply is protected by fuse F4 - 2 AT, and 3 A is entered in Fig. 7. What rating is required for the fuse protection?

Answer: The power supply (mains connection socket) must be protected with a 2 AT fuse. The fuse shown in the drawing is incorrect.

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Question/problem:
What is to be done when error E10 is displayed? What causes this error?

Answer: Principally: the control box of the ModuVario performs a bleeding programme every time it is switched on, or after power failures. This bleeding programme is also performed after a type E1, E7 and E13 locks are reset.

Bleeding programme sequence:
During the bleeding programme, the boiler pump in ModuVario units with SystaCompact controllers first switches the boiler pump on and off at regular intervals to remove air from the heat exchanger via the automatic air bleed valves. The boiler pump runs constantly in the ModuVario with SystaComfort controllers. The heating circuit pump(s) is/are switched on for 3 minutes and the mixers run.
After approximately 90 seconds, the burner is activated for approximately 5 seconds in both the SystaCompact and the SystaComfort. After the burner is switched off and after a wait period of approximately 5 seconds, the automatic firing device measures the (T between the supply and return. If the (T is now less than or equal to 5 Kelvin, the boiler switches to normal operation (operating mode 0, 3 or 4). If the (T is greater than 5 Kelvin, the automatic firing device starts the burner again for approx. 5 seconds. If the (T is greater than 5 Kelvin again after the burner is switched off and after the wait period, the automatic firing device assumes that the system has not been bled properly or that water is not circulating. The boiler then displays fault E10.

Bypass valve function:
The bypass valve merely prevents excessive temperatures of the boiler during normal heating operation if the thermostat valves close. However, the bypass valve cannot supply the minimum circulation quantity during the bleeding programme.

Conclusion and troubleshooting:
During the bleeding programme, heating water must be able to flow through one or more radiators. This is accomplished by opening any closed thermostat valves or removing one or more thermostat heads. Further information:

We are currently investigating whether the minimum water circulation quantity can be reduced during the bleeding programme so that the volume flow via the bypass valve is sufficient.

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